极品人生

标题: Pass XA160.5寻找VTL TL-7.5 Series III 及其它前級声音畅谈 [打印本页]

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-28 08:52
标题: Pass XA160.5寻找VTL TL-7.5 Series III 及其它前級声音畅谈
本帖最后由 LCL123 于 2012-4-3 09:00 编辑

VTL TL7.5旗舰真空管前级已进入第三代，据说用料及声音堪称完美。
反正不管第几代俺都不了解，它的声音到底怎样啊？

请知道的朋友谈谈！谢谢！

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-28 09:11
[attach]46080[/attach][attach]46082[/attach][attach]46083[/attach]发几组图片
[attach]46078[/attach]

作者: xgl890 时间: 2012-3-28 10:16
此机不是很热！但是声音确实不错，前几年听过他家的顶级前后，推某音箱速度感冲击力都不错！是我听过为数不多的好搭配！

作者: 壮士 时间: 2012-3-28 10:17

VTL TL-7.5旗舰真空管前级已进入第三代，据说用料及声音堪称完美。
反正不管第几代俺都不了解，它的声音到 ...
LCL123 发表于 2012-3-28 08:52

顛峰之癲 ---标题改一下

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-28 10:41
不好意思，标题是照书抄复制过来的

作者: 壮士 时间: 2012-3-28 10:47
也在为前级头疼，进来学习一下。

作者: sm163 时间: 2012-3-28 11:07
Octave前级也可关注下，本坛iebestod在用，也对比过同档次的前级，据说不错。

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-3-28 12:41
比arc4o周年怎么样啊

作者: dragon 时间: 2012-3-28 12:41
胆机前级的话，CJ的最新限量版GAT也很强，用两根6922放大

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-28 13:08
本帖最后由 LCL123 于 2012-3-28 13:20 编辑

此机不是很热！但是声音确实不错，前几年听过他家的顶级前后，推某音箱速度感冲击力都不错！是我听过为数不 ...
xgl890 发表于 2012-3-28 10:16

我想想声音大概是是这样走向，不知道是不是HIFI感强没味道声音很硬这种啊？

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-28 13:14

胆机前级的话，CJ的最新限量版GAT也很强，用两根6922放大
dragon 发表于 2012-3-28 12:41

就是考虑管少，确切点说这个TL7.5是个胆混石前级

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-28 13:16

胆机前级的话，CJ的最新限量版GAT也很强，用两根6922放大
dragon 发表于 2012-3-28 12:41

主要是为搭配160.5 ，好声音的胆前级选择还是很多的呵呵...

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-3-28 13:31
觉得银彩的c1挺搭的

作者: 老头2 时间: 2012-3-28 13:37
回复 LCL123 的帖子

呵呵～～也在寻160.5的前级。盼各位指点！

作者: xgl890 时间: 2012-3-28 13:41

我想想声音大概是是这样走向，不知道是不是HIFI感强没味道声音很硬这种啊？
LCL123 发表于 2012-3-28 13:08

那到不会，应该前后级都是胆石的，声音有胆机的味道也有石机的特质。

作者: 初哥哥 时间: 2012-3-28 13:43
请问 VTL 与 ARC 有什么风格差异？

作者: 小黑 时间: 2012-3-28 13:43
前段时间，我对这台机器的声音也很感兴趣。打听了一阵，也没找到了解的人。

作者: dragon 时间: 2012-3-28 14:05
本帖最后由 dragon 于 2012-3-28 14:56 编辑

回复 LCL123 的帖子

CJ也是胆石混合的，上次在香港中环的雅典试音室听了一个下午，绕梁三日
美国美国conrad-johnson，老牌子了
枪文http://www.whaudio.com/qicai/2010-01/1264002333d1568.html

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-28 14:14

觉得银彩的c1挺搭的
guhelim 发表于 2012-3-28 13:31

好象听老兄您提起过银彩C1的，银彩也做前级的啊？方便的话发个图片看看

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-28 14:20

前段时间，我对这台机器的声音也很感兴趣。打听了一阵，也没找到了解的人。
小黑发表于 2012-3-28 13:43

黑兄M8到位了吗？M8胆位浓些，声音肯定超毒的。
基本上欧洲器材讲的是味道而美国器材讲的是音场多一点，不知道TL7.5音场比M8好些没有呢？

作者: 小黑 时间: 2012-3-28 17:33
M8还没到手，工厂生产速度超慢。

关于M8和VTL7.5的对比，我真是一点概念也没有，猜都没法猜。

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-28 21:36

M8还没到手，工厂生产速度超慢。
关于M8和VTL7.5的对比，我真是一点概念也没有，猜都没法猜。
小黑发表于 2012-3-28 17:33

确实如此，VTL比较冷门，关于它的讨论更是少的可怜。

这里倒有一篇文章：

VTL TL-7.5 Series III

日期: 2012-03-20 文章来源:《高保真音响》2012年3月刊

VTL旗舰电子管电子前级
TL-7.5 Series III

文/王惠祺

笔者多年来听过的高级前级放大器不计其数，但留下深刻印象的却并不多，这其中就包括了ARCSP-10、ARC Anniversary Reference、CJ Art II、Marantz 7、Jadis JP-200和Audio Note M10等，它们的共同点是都能提供浓郁的音乐感，并且有着令人无法离座的强大吸引力。当年我用CJ Art II播唱一曲蔡琴的《被遗忘的时光》，其音色之靓与人声之真，令笔者至今仍无法忘记。近期，我又用ARC Anniversary Ref.加Ref.150推动Sonus Faber Guarneri，不但弦乐音色异常靓声，擦弦声更像是贴身而来……

去年初秋，我到好友“Hi-Fi德”家中聆听一套价值近20万的分体前级—VTL TL-7.5 Series III，播唱的North Star的《Incredible Voilin》，到歌剧《卡门》的序曲《Moderato》播出时，那种跳跃的小提琴动感，真实得吓人的现场气氛和那一份像擦身而过的弦声质感，可说声音靓得使我害怕，而到曲中的敲击衬托播出时，其宽广宏大的气势，令我首次怀疑Rockport Mira的低音单元是否已到了极限！

VTL TL-7.5 Series III分体电子管前级，堪称VTL有史以来最昂贵、最豪华的前级放大器，此机即使撇除Phono Stage（唱头放大）只有Line Amp(线路放大)部分都要二十多万！TL-7.5 Series III（第三代），主要改良重点在于电源配置方面，而部分最重要的环节之零件，亦经更准确地配对，平均150颗电阻中，仅有两颗达到90%以上对称度，方可入选TL-7.5 Series III的选配名单。要知道TH TL-7.5 Series III是一部真正的平衡前级，部分放大元件一开四份，左右声道各自的正弦波负弦波，完全达到左右声道对称是非常困难的事，加上电源部分又要左右对称配合，绝对是非常艰巨的任务。

TH TL-7.5 Series III音量衰减电位器的阵容，是笔者见过所有前级中最具规模的，主放大箱内的左右边缘，从上到下两列电路，正是用以控制音量处理，所用的伺服电路、继电器数量很多。由于是全平衡设计，这组设于机箱内两旁的电路，原来还有两层。VTL设计TH TL-7.5 Series III的音量组件时，目的是让不同音量时，音色动态都保持一致。笔者就曾播唱最爆的《尺八传说》，当用很小的音量聆听，令人惊奇是那一层层鼓皮回弹的低音余波，仍是听得很清楚，低频暗涌依然感觉得到。

不得不提的是，TH-7.5S-III的两个机箱中，上方较小的一件，有选择控制键，音量衰减键和其他按键的机箱，其实是分体电源装置的部分，反而是装载前级放大电路的机箱，这种反传统的布局，目的是让放大电路的机箱体不会受到任何干扰（就连导线都分成电源和信号两组），令重放音色清晰透明、平衡度高，这与全无干扰的放大设计息息相关。

TH-7.5S-III所用的电子管只有两只12AU7，主要用在前级的放大部分，这种设计经过长时间试验才采用的，而不是盲目地在所有位置都用上电子管。当然，这对于一般的电子管机爱好者来说，可能感到有点不是味儿，但出奇的是，当聆听女声天碟时，TH-7.5S-III能够展现出醇厚的人声质感，一如采用很多只电子管的前级在开声。TH-7.5S-III最令我欣赏之处，不是其昂贵的大制作，也不是崭新的设计布局，而是当我播唱任何类型的CD时，那种惊天动地的力度，可谓完全体验出前级在声音美学与技术设计之间的整合！

播唱近期的热门录音《Audiophile Female Voice 4》，当播唱到《Only Love Can Break Your Heart》一曲时，Jacqui Naylor的歌声余韵绕梁，细节更是扣人心弦，Jaqui字与字之间的密度，口水声、换气声都可轻易听得出来，相信只有世上最顶级的前级方可做到。

总结
在同样的组合里，我接回其他前级，声音随即寡淡如水，了无生气，在如此A/B对比的条件下，TH-7.5S-III的优势无疑更加明显。TH-7.5S-III真可算得上是当今最佳的前级放大器之一，因为不少效果是我从未在其他前级上听过的。

免责声明：本文章转载自所标来源的音响杂志，版权归其所有，如版权持有者对所转载文章有异议，请与本网站管理员联系。

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-3-28 21:53
回复 LCL123 的帖子
http://review.u-audio.com.tw/reviewdetail.asp?reviewid=416

台湾郭哥哥写的枪文

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-3-28 21:56
http://taifuaudio.cis.justgogo.tw/cis/ContentV2.aspx?mp=26054
陶哥哥写的

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-28 22:33

陶哥哥写的
guhelim 发表于 2012-3-28 21:56

是台真正品音乐的极品前级

估计价格也是“极品”

作者: zyuv888 时间: 2012-3-28 22:37

是台真正品音乐的极品前级估计价格也是“极品”
LCL123 发表于 2012-3-28 22:33

目标瞄准了吗？

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-28 22:39

目标瞄准了吗？
zyuv888 发表于 2012-3-28 22:37

现在是休闲时区，慢慢找

作者: lintianshi 时间: 2012-3-28 23:50
我还是推荐Conrad Johnson

作者: s1.4 时间: 2012-3-29 09:18
不懂要学习！~

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-30 10:27
问了下7.5 III的价格居然和Audio Note M8接近

作者: sm163 时间: 2012-3-30 10:32

问了下7.5 III的价格居然和Audio Note M8接近
LCL123 发表于 2012-3-30 10:27

呵

声音这不管如何

首先价格是不能落后的

作者: 红苹果 时间: 2012-3-30 10:46

呵声音这不管如何首先价格是不能落后的
sm163 发表于 2012-3-30 10:32

这话是现有产品最经典的代名词。

作者: sm163 时间: 2012-3-30 10:54

这话是现有产品最经典的代名词。
红苹果发表于 2012-3-30 10:46

准备器材退烧

多收点好软件

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-30 11:00

准备器材退烧多收点好软件
sm163 发表于 2012-3-30 10:54

是的声音差不多就算了，多用点时间找软件区，看来其他搭配都不熟，我就确定30SS了

作者: sm163 时间: 2012-3-30 11:02
本帖最后由 sm163 于 2012-3-30 11:04 编辑

是啊

本想升级前级，m8的价格确实有点

30SS搭你的系统保险点，回来后调整下线材应该很不错的

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-30 11:21

是啊本想升级前级，m8的价格确实有点 30SS搭你的系统保险点，回来后调整下线材应该很不错的:l ...
sm163 发表于 2012-3-30 11:02

嗯，升了M8后到时又想升M10

作者: 小黑 时间: 2012-3-30 11:34
说话请考虑影响哦。

作者: 小黑 时间: 2012-3-30 11:36
说话要注意影响哦。

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-3-30 11:44

说话要注意影响哦。
小黑发表于 2012-3-30 11:36

影响你也没办法，你就改订M10吧！免得下次再升一次麻烦

作者: 小黑 时间: 2012-3-30 11:53
淡定、淡定。

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-4-2 18:12
本帖最后由 guhelim 于 2012-4-2 18:14 编辑

刚看到好像说leben搭pass不错~~价格也不贵~去试试??????

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-4-2 18:14
Leben RS28CX preamp
by Paolo Dimarcoberardino

Speaking of a “Leben” product is like walking middle way in a sort of innovative ground which is not a compromise, but rather meditated choices and reasonableness.

The motive is that the Japanese through and through brand doesn’t reach the peaks of esotericism and price like the products of Audio Note Kondo or Audio Tekne, just to mention two well-known brands of the Land of the Rising Sun. While these ones have made of their creed and personal way of being on the market a sort of “audiophile Puritanism”, Leben seeks another direction. In fact it’s not about exclusive circuit choices or a particular passive component, on which Mr Kondo has found its planning creed, but it’s about a purpose of musical research. A research not much standardized in a modern audiophile world where everything seems to play in a way that is uniform or alike.

Leben’s creator, Mr. Hyodo San, started his career designing tube devices with Luxman. Besides, he brought about an added value for an audio builder: the fact of being a guitarist and a musician too.

In the sober but nice website, you can find few but significant news concerning the production based on three preamplifiers, one only phono, two integrated and, at the moment, one power amp.

Mr. Hyodo didn’t give in at the very profitable temptation of dividing the production (I could say… as others did, a bit cunningly… yes, I say it) into qualitative “steps” more and more expensive of the same device. Maybe changing a handful of quite cheap internal components in order to justify a final price twice increased. He has simply focussed himself on a small number of machines where the differences rest on the preamp functionality or on the output power of the amplifications, rather than on the musical performances which always respond to the designer’s best intentions.

In brief, no easily improvable or intentionally not improved product comes out from his artisanal lab. There are no MK versions or additional changes of an object. Every product enters the market mature or fully responding to its aims.

The solely concession to “change” are the kind of tubes placed into each device. Being a lover of them, he rightly thinks that the best performances come from the exemplars produced till the end of the ‘80s. So he prefers to use NOS valves, when available, instead of new types, with the unavoidable variability of the electric parameters during the years.

The musical box

The outcome of the test on the Leben RS28CX preamplifier requires a close analysis to exhaust all its cues and characteristics. Let’s start saying that it’s not brand new: the very first C version has been issued since 1998, although it was a different product and project, moreover with different tubes, while the CX model dates back to 2006.

So why coming back to the subject?

As far as I’m concerned, at least for two reasons.

The first is the high quality of this gear that deserves a further deepening and a sort of consecration. Of course, always pointing out any strength and weakness since every object which reproduces music, also the dearest and exclusive one, has got some faults. At least as regards the “reproduction” issue. The second reason is the praise that has to be recognised to the productive policy of the brand which makes of the longevity of its products a commercial creed: an added value for the purchaser.

Those who love the novelty at all costs resign themselves to it and let themselves “fall” in the net of who appears, surely not phony, but unquestionably commercially astute.

Maybe someone would consider what I’m saying as excessive or politically incorrect, but, you know, sometimes it can be useful. Indeed!

Moreover this preamp, with the passing of time, plays always better. You can find out new emotions while listening to the records you think to know deep inside: in short, it needs time, your time.

How it is made up

The appearance of a machine is something easy to see and evaluate with our own eyes. This is why I do not like talking about it, but I'll make an exception with this Leben.

There's a similarity with some old products due to the gold coloured refinement, which recalls the great age of Luxman, or to the well refined and polished wooden sides.

It’s a charming object consonant to your listening room, whether it’s a typical bare room of some sad audiophiles or a common living room.

In this model, the power supply circuit is set into an identical small unit, not very heavy, to be placed with the main chassis, a couple of centimetres aside.

There’s nothing so gigantic here to strike the imagination of the most unwary customer; no brainwaves or subterfuges just to look like something else: only grace and sense of measure.

Good level for the components and good make for the connectors. As the circuit is nearly air wired, this represents an advantage - for the constancy of the performances in the course of time- if compared with the common Polychlorinated biphenyls printed circuits.

Welding and junctions are well made and if you look inside you can notice that everything has been made, besides in an artisanal way, in an easy way too. I do love praising slowness.

The passive components are very good without strange esoteric capacitors realized in the nights of full moon: electrolytic Nichicon and Elna with metallic polypropylene (when low values are required) Riken resistors and an Alps Blu potentiometer.

In the feeding block there’s an adequate traditional transformer with a NOS RCA 5Y3WGTA tube and a solid state stabilisation, together with an inductive filtering system.

The gain circuit counts a Shunt Regulated Push Pull (SRPP) scheme used for years by several manufacturers (i.e. one out of four or five circuits needed to build a preamp), which is generally defined by an output low impedance and a high gain. The gain here can go up to 25,2 db with a maximum output equal to 80 V: a very high value, sufficient to drive any power amp.

Luckily Mr. Hyodo, on the rear of the pre, has put a small potentiometer to make variable the output on the RCA clamps. This because, if used, the fixed output can be excessive with normal sensitivity power amps, like my Pass.

It can be useful though, to calibrate this potentiometer and using, for customary listening levels, the normal volume switch set around 12:00 hours even if, the fixed output, without another potentiometer, can guarantee a higher clearness level.

The line stage’s tubes are two 6CG7 General Electric; tube that at that time was used not only in the audio segment but also for the deflection of the TV sets. It’s a strong tube, in brief a version with Noval socket of the famous 6SN7. It has been employed by many manufacturers, for example Audio Research and Conrad Johnson, as driving stadium for tube power amps.

The phono stage follows what Mr. Hyodo considers a masterpiece: the scheme of the Harman Kardon Citation IV. A CR type equalizer with passive Riaa, free from any negative feedback, here only between the two stadiums made active by the two General Electric 12AT7.

CR type equalization requires a gain level of only 20db and that needs a gain step-up transformer paired with MC cartridges with an output not very low, let’s say not below 0,3 MV.

In this case the generosity of the line stage is helpful and by using the fixed output the low gain of the phono is partially balanced.

I’ve personally recourse with great satisfaction to my Lyra Lidian Beta whit its quite strong output. Nonetheless it has been sufficient to pair it with two step-ups with a transformation ratio 1:10 to obtain a congruous gain.

To minimize noise problems are needed a careful estimate of the mass points and an exemplar building. However, the choice of the circuits and the intentional lack of a counter reaction do not follow the direction of low surface noises. In addition Mr. Hyodo has inserted the tubes in a metal container to prevent microphonic effects.

The pre is rather versatile with a balance control (very useful indeed) and a double input bar (less useful…). There’s also a warm-up system which gives current to the tubes progressively, as prefigured by Mr Hyodo in all his devices to preserve the tubes’ health. A pilot on the front shows the full efficiency.

The pre needs at least thirty minute warming up to express its best, but after few nanoseconds tells to the lucky owner what it’s capable of.

Listening

Smart audiophiles, who develop their system with humility and judiciousness, improving their sensitivity without turning to the plethora of “autosanctified pundits”, know very well the importance of the preamplifier.

Some lightweight technocrats will tell you that’s not true; when all is said and done the preamp is only a gain damper, hence an unnecessary component.

I’ve never listened to a system whose source was directly connected to the power amp playing more than decently, included the almost entire range with a passive pre.

I mean, the pre is necessary and it has to be of a superior quality level than the other components of the system.

You can buy the most expensive loudspeakers, the most transparent and dynamic source, but if your preamp it’s just mediocre, the sound will be mediocre too.

Today it’s quite difficult to find, at the same price of this Leben preamp, a gear that performs very badly. Better, I’d say that most products of this category show a pleasantly “Hi-Fi” sound, well-balanced even if, quite often, a bit standardized.

Maybe it’s something related to our times, where the majority desires only objects that are appeasing and homogenous, let’s say standardized and not very demanding: neither an effort in searching the best conditions of use, nor a different listening or something that can catch us “unprepared”. The aim of Taku Hyodo san is the reaching of a natural sound with a firm personal character connotations. A sound maybe not so catchy (and then tiring) but a sound that generate in the user’s psyche a “certainty of sound”.

I can actually say that the RS28CX offers recognizable musical performances with an evident naturalness and without any listening weariness.

Its voice is peculiar indeed, but nevertheless close to reality.

I inserted the preamp in my system using two different power amps: the solid state Pass XA 30.5 and the valve state BAT VK 55 SE (this last one with adapters RCA/XLR), with my faithful Martin Logan SL3, which are extremely revealing of what is at the beginning of the system, and the digital source Naim CD5X fed with its FlatCap 2X.

The pre analog stage has been tested using the Lyra Lydian beta interfaced with a Jensen step-up with a transformation ratio of 1:10. It allows you to obtain a congruous gain without mortifying the dynamic qualities of the Japanese pickup which reads a load impedance of 470 Ohms: in my opinion the best with this cartridge.

The Leben line stage shows great neutrality, with the low range typically valvelike, that is just soft and not very fast, never overfull or pasty, definitely in line with the entire range.

The timbre is wide open in the medium-low range, with the high frequencies very “flat” and fine-grained as deserved by a high rank machine; this preamp is a fine chisel, a gear that can entirely represent what the source send to it and, substantially, an excellent and transparent “tuner” of the entire system.

Everything with the Leben seems to find its place with balance and great naturalness.

Voices are never artificial or with a timbric deviation and all the sonic characteristics bring back reciprocally in a ground made of sound truth, both with a sax or a string quartet.

Lots of dynamic but without strains or unnatural accelerations: all flows with no effort and very close to the live performances, exactly how our ears expect to listen to.

With small ensembles, jazz or classic, there’s the capability of catching punctually the single instruments very well defined and sculptured, the excellent air of the scene and the concrete timbre which gives back the sounds with intimacy.

A hearing pleasure with no listening exertion at all.

The great class comes out with more demanding programmes where many competitors turn their elevated detail into stridency and their marked dynamic into continuous and not very homogeneous strains.

The Leben keeps its naturalness instead without loosing control and musical coherence: briefly no breathlessness.

If you get some problems in pumping up the volume, which becomes less pleasant with the increasing of the level, you should listen what happens with the RS28CX, that simply doesn’t modify anything with the varying of the potentiometer but reproduces it louder.

Like with all the Leben devices, also here the harmonic content is of a high level and the instruments are never affected or not lively. You feel like listening to the finest reproduction of something real, palpable and solidly tangible.

Sometimes it’s just a touch, an echo or an intonation or maybe a sense of realism hardly describable, but with this preamp you can listen first of all the humanity and the truth of the recording.

And the rest, made of frequencies, dynamic and detail comes afterwards.

The phono stage gives a softer timbre than the line stage, more personal and warm in the midrange and a bit more valvelike, in a classical meaning, in the low frequencies.

The Lyra has a good control on the low range and is very synergic. So it would be advisable to pair any pick ups with similar characteristics, avoiding those “very mellow” and slightly dynamic which, however, is better to stay away from them, ever…

The midrange becomes warmer, agreeably euphonic, even if in a correct and measured way.

It’s like a bit of romanticism in your setting up. That afflatus we’re always seeking when we are trying to assemble very good analog systems and that the Leben expresses with velvet decision.

Beautiful indeed the top range, extremely polished, measured but well extended, in short musical.

I realize that with a record by B.B. King recently bought in London on a stall, which is definitely poorly recorded but with the Leben seems more listenable as it fixes the critical and sharp midhigh frequencies and the little homogeneous high frequencies.

This Leben seems to be the care for every audiophile disorder.

With the classical music the correct timbre, never aseptic, makes every score enjoyable, with very good transparency skills.

In the Beethoven Symphony No 9 (Karajan, 1962, Deutsche Grammophon) you can clearly perceive the expressive power of the first movement, as well as the poetry of the third or the exaltation of the fourth.

The strings, in this recording a little sour, are given back with rare mastery as the sound came from the rubbing of the bow on the string, from the contact of the materials.

Same clear impression with the Four Seasons of the Solisti Veneti (RCA), were the soloist has a sureness of touch but the instrument is never unnatural or without harmonics.

In short, with every kind of music the Leben is able to amalgamate your feelings with the chosen music, both with the distort notes of Hendrix and the genial intuitions of Mozart.

Also the treatment of the voices is exemplary, maybe the best thing the Leben can do, thanks to its harmonic truth which turns every word into reality.

I freeze head-on the beauty of Suzanne by Leonard Cohen or the pitiless desperation of Strange Fruit by Lady Day.

The sibilants are totally without grain and as happened with the strings, also here it’s clearly perceivable the “physical” origin of the sound, that is the vibration of the vocal cords, the air emission of the diaphragm.

Same sharp certainty with the winds, where the sensation of the air insufflate in the instrument is clear, with the intonations and small mistakes that every musician can do, also the best ones.

Definitely extraordinary.

Conclusions

From the employable point of view, the Leben is a very universal preamp, both for the high gain which gets and for the possibility of adapting the output through the back switch when driving a very sensitive power amp.

Both Pass and BAT felt very comfortable with it, expressing their best.

With a more airy preamp the Pass would have given an outcome too unbalanced in the midrange, whilst a warmer mid range joint to a more vigorous bass range would have given, with the BAT, a timbre not very homogenous.

But the Leben has driven these different power amps with correctness and extreme musicality.

I think there are on the market preamps more transparent or dynamic than the Leben, others more engaging and airy, others more solid in doing bass.

All these qualities are present in the RS28CX but are wisely and exclusively interpenetrate in a music machine that achieves the goal of bringing you to the core of music, forgetting all the rest.

It can fully solve your doubts and perplexities and realign your head with the wish of emotion.

It can divert the system from every straining or excess, taking away insane thoughts about cables and diabolic accessories and let you think only of Music.

Need something else?

SCHEME SUMMARY

top score ***** stars

Timbric ****1/2 | Correct with a mid range just warm and a mid high range very broad and determined. Very enjoyable.

Dynamic **** | Indeed realistic and without splits, fluid and controlled.

Detail **** | High with no unnatural efforts in the perception of the secondary details

Clearness**** line ***1/2 phono | High level, mostly the line stage, less the phono stage.

Image **** | Realistic and never afflicted by a wide angle perception. More developed in length than in width.

Velocity ***1/2 | Quick impulses, mostly in the mid high range, less in the bass. Descent fronts never sudden or flat, also for the consistent harmonic content.

Manufacture ****1/2 | Great level with air wiring embellished by the separate unit. Standard equipment with NOS tubes. Excellent and personal look.

Price/quality ratio ***** | Extraordinary if compared to the musical performances and the included phono stage.

Official technical specifications:

Tube Complement: 2 x 6CG7 (G.E.); 2 x 12AT7 (G.E.); 1 x 5Y3WGT

RIAA Curve; <0,3 dB

Gain phono: 20,2 dB

Input: 400 mV (2KHz)

Gain line: 25,2 dB

Output: 80V

Output Impedance: 580Ohms

Weight: kg 13,5 (main body+ power supply)

Official Italian dealer: to the Audio Point Italia website

Official current price in Italy: 6,840.00 EUR

RIGHT OF REPLY | MANUFACTURERS FEEDBACK

Dear Mr. Castelli, Mr. Rocchi,
Thank you very much for your nice review on Leben RS-28CX.
Your evaluation is just hitting a thought of Mr. Hyodo.
Mr. Hyodo was willing to sell RS-28CX as an independent apparatus(not as a set with a power amp), RS-28CX was designed to match with several power amps regardless to its sensitivity.
Another point of this preamp is the phono stage.
As you clearly indicated, in order to bring a full capability of CR-type/Non-NFB phono equalizer, Mr. Hyodo decided to have a separate power supply.
Therefore, we do not have any extra comments to your perfect review.
Thank you very much.
Yoshi Hontani, Managing Director

17/11/2011

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-2 19:31

刚看到好像说leben搭pass不错~~价格也不贵~去试试??????
guhelim 发表于 2012-4-2 18:12

是日本产的，杂志上有介绍，可能搭Pass X系列好点，搭配XA系列看来要找晶体管会好点

作者: 取经之路 时间: 2012-4-2 21:39
在桑威音响听过VTL全套顶配推飞思，声音不错。

作者: 棍棍 时间: 2012-4-2 22:21
今天又看到发烧站上有人在出MARK32

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-2 22:55

今天又看到发烧站上有人在出MARK32
棍棍发表于 2012-4-2 22:21

呵呵，32虽然是台前级放大器但发热也很厉害，听说修理过的也很多，除非要有未修过的身份证或一手用家否则不敢下手。

看缘分吧！32也是我的杯中茶，等段时间看看有没有比较熟悉的烧友出手32 ，不然就买新的30SS Series 2算了，听说小改款的30SS Series 2比第一代30SS 质感、冲击力好很多。
主要现在在外地出差否则早就下手了呵呵

作者: sm163 时间: 2012-4-2 23:03
回复 LCL123 的帖子
32你还能找到一手用家？现在出的二手不知到过几回了

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-2 23:13

回复
32你还能找到一手用家？现在出的二手不知到过几回了
sm163 发表于 2012-4-2 23:03

是的，很难买到了。发烧友对Pass 前级负面评价太热烈，不然XP30长得也蛮帅的

[attach]46483[/attach][attach]46484[/attach]

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-4-2 23:47
3件套太多了

作者: 常在 时间: 2012-4-3 02:03
新一代pass前级比旧的分别很大，特别高频伸展十分好，声音高贵很多，最近入了xp-20前级跟pass副牌j2合拍很多，比以前ARC LS26前级不知好了多少倍。

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-3 08:31

新一代pass前级比旧的分别很大，特别高频伸展十分好，声音高贵很多，最近入了xp-20前级跟pass副牌j2合拍很多 ...
常在发表于 2012-4-3 02:03

原来听说Pass 前级声音不够细致，没有内涵，音乐位差比较直接，所以只能在其它前级中选择，目前XP30价格好象有点水份。

作者: wangls 时间: 2012-4-3 09:19
请问常在兄pass xp20高低二档增益怎样设定？我这台的mode键似乎只能调display,盼赐教。

作者: 常在 时间: 2012-4-3 15:24
回复 LCL123 的帖子

XP30贵20一倍，声音取向有所不同，如果大环境大系统定选30，当时买20时经销商借30和20给我拿回家听10天才决定买那台机，最后选择了20，因为价钱相对平很多，细细声讲凡是PASS后级用家定要找台新一代前级配下，就知道一套西装的威力，xp10就不用试了起步20，二手就不要考虑，现在一二手价相当接近。

作者: 常在 时间: 2012-4-3 15:34
回复 wangls 的帖子

这个我还没有用过，看说明书讲两段增益从0db到10db的调整，就这个问题刚打电话去问经销商处问，他也不清楚要等节后上班才告诉我。到时定通知兄您，谢谢。

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-3 17:09

回复

XP30贵20一倍，声音取向有所不同，如果大环境大系统定选30，当时买20时经销商借30和20给我拿回家听 ...
常在发表于 2012-4-3 15:24

常客兄真“幸福”啊

商家能同时提供两台前级试用，一套西装流畅度、协调性肯定肯定好。

请兄PM下XP20/XP30的商家及分别价格。谢谢！

作者: 笑乐 时间: 2012-4-3 17:17
俺也在辛苦找前级，有台ML32在谈，但仍下不了决心，大家多谈谈吧。

作者: 常在 时间: 2012-4-3 18:46
回复 LCL123 的帖子
现在一手商服务态度好到不得了，海印名门xp20,4万7 xp30比20贵一倍。

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-3 18:47
发几张XP30图片

[attach]46535[/attach][attach]46536[/attach][attach]46537[/attach]

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-3 18:50
发几张30SS图片

[attach]46538[/attach][attach]46539[/attach][attach]46540[/attach][attach]46541[/attach]

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-4-3 19:14
登峰的720，721也可以试下

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-3 19:16
大家谈谈里面用料及调音线路技巧方面吧

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-3 21:19

登峰的720，721也可以试下
guhelim 发表于 2012-4-3 19:14

这个前级大概多少银子啊？

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-4-3 21:27
应该20不到

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-3 22:10

应该20不到
guhelim 发表于 2012-4-3 21:27

没有20也有15 ，吃不消啊！

作者: 木耳朵 时间: 2012-4-5 13:45
Halcro DM10 为啥不考虑看看，，，，，，？

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-5 14:07

Halcro DM10 为啥不考虑看看，，，，，，？
木耳朵发表于 2012-4-5 13:45

哦！找个时间去查查看，主要想找其它牌子并且有搭配过案例的前级，如果Pass XP30比以前0.2有翻天覆地的变化那一套就更协调点，不过对这个前级还是不能看好。

作者: LP\茶 时间: 2012-4-5 14:42
本帖最后由 LP\茶于 2012-4-5 14:44 编辑

PASS的输入阻抗比较高,搭配前级需要找增益较高的前级.也曾经瞄准过CJ.尝试过搭配感觉动态欠缺了..美国海伦也是个不错的机器,声音较清淡中性.换管可以中和一下韵味..ARC太老气,配PASS不对味.随便YY一下.真正搭配还是要自己亲自听一下.现在我是用ROGUE Audio的前级.VTL的前级和后级也是很不错的,但没实际搭配过

作者: LP\茶 时间: 2012-4-5 15:37
本帖最后由 LP\茶于 2012-4-5 15:43 编辑

大家谈谈里面用料及调音线路技巧方面吧
LCL123 发表于 2012-4-3 19:16

CJ前级用料和电路非常发烧,整流部分是晶体管整流.就算低班的新款ET3SE是一部非常优秀的前级.可惜配搭PASS确实少了动态.但搭它自家的后级要啥有啥...好的前级全面的机器现在多是晶体管整流,

作者: 小黑 时间: 2012-4-5 16:43

呵呵，32虽然是台前级放大器但发热也很厉害，听说修理过的也很多，除非要有未修过的身份证或一手用家否则不 ...
LCL123 发表于 2012-4-2 22:55

我的M8要是到了表现好，MARK32有可能会出掉，不过现在还说不准，有可能两台换着听。
我的MARK 32很难得，是2500号以后的，成色超好，购买后专门找人检查过，没有修磨过的。

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-5 19:00

我的M8要是到了表现好，MARK32有可能会出掉，不过现在还说不准，有可能两台换着听。
我的MARK 32很难得， ...
小黑发表于 2012-4-5 16:43

哦！好啊！希望您的M8表现好。

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-5 19:02

CJ前级用料和电路非常发烧,整流部分是晶体管整流.就算低班的新款ET3SE是一部非常优秀的前级.可惜配搭PASS ...
LP\茶发表于 2012-4-5 15:37

是的，胆前级最难搭了。

作者: 常在 时间: 2012-4-30 16:45
回复 wangls 的帖子

刚接到香港代理电话告之，pass xp20是没有增益可调的，让您久等了，不好意思。

作者: 残月 时间: 2012-4-30 17:05
如果喜欢中性的音色，登峰720真是不错，音质非常纯净细致，马克32个人感觉声音比登峰来的直白一些

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-4-30 18:40

如果喜欢中性的音色，登峰720真是不错，音质非常纯净细致，马克32个人感觉声音比登峰来的直白一些
残月发表于 2012-4-30 17:05

是的，登峰是瑞士一个新兴的HIEND品牌，声音品质不容置疑。
只是暂时目标不想订的太高，最重要是基于对PASS后级搭配协调性上的考虑，既然很多前辈很看好士必草前级，就订了一台试试喽，过几天应该就会到位呵呵...

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-4-30 23:06
回复残月的帖子
对的我觉得登峰是金体机的顶峰了

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-4-30 23:07
登峰和pass xa也算绝配

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-5-1 00:32

登峰和pass xa也算绝配
guhelim 发表于 2012-4-30 23:07

在以前买马克之前士必草就是我的梦幻前级，现在又听说与160.5很搭，不搞到手会很遗憾的，如果还是不行只能再折腾了

作者: sm163 时间: 2012-5-1 00:38

在以前买马克之前士必草就是我的梦幻前级，现在又听说与160.5很搭，不搞到手会很遗憾的，如果还是不行只能再 ...
LCL123 发表于 2012-5-1 00:32

没必要，士必草定会满足你的

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-5-1 00:45

没必要，士必草定会满足你的
sm163 发表于 2012-5-1 00:38

谢谢王兄的支持，让俺信心备增啊！

作者: rock 时间: 2012-5-1 09:11

如果喜欢中性的音色，登峰720真是不错，音质非常纯净细致，马克32个人感觉声音比登峰来的直白一些
残月发表于 2012-4-30 17:05

我的感觉是 Solution 远比ML32 清寡,无味和直白...正是这样一种特性让人觉得Solution只是一件工业产品而已...

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-5-1 09:17

我的感觉是 Solution 远比ML32 清寡,无味和直白...正是这样一种特性让人觉得Solution只是一件工业产品而 ...
rock 发表于 2012-5-1 09:11

密度和能量感比32更好

作者: rock 时间: 2012-5-1 09:21

密度和能量感比32更好
guhelim 发表于 2012-5-1 09:17

也许是,但没有意义..Solution的技术指标做得非常好,从工业生产的角度来讲,它无可挑剔...但一件好的音响器材,最重要的是音乐的体现...从这方面讲,它的"密度和能量感比32更好"是毫无意义的．

作者: 笑乐 时间: 2012-5-1 10:48

是的，登峰是瑞士一个新兴的HIEND品牌，声音品质不容置疑。
只是暂时目标不想订的太高，最重要是基于对PAS ...
LCL123 发表于 2012-4-30 18:40

我也在为160.5找老公，

期待上详细听感。

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-5-1 10:56

我也在为160.5找老公，

期待上详细听感。
笑乐发表于 2012-5-1 10:48

到时一定汇报

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-5-1 12:22
回复 rock 的帖子
关键是搭配;登峰不能整套用;我听过dcs3件套+登峰720+passxa200.5推小证据;横不错的可以弥补dcs和pass的弱项

作者: rock 时间: 2012-5-1 12:24

回复
关键是搭配;登峰不能整套用;我听过dcs3件套+登峰720+passxa200.5推小证据;横不错的可以弥补dcs和pas ...
guhelim 发表于 2012-5-1 12:22

Solution这样的机器,相信也是花了心血去做的,否则指标不可能做得如此出色,但厂家也许忘了机器是为音乐服务的...好歹找个懂音乐的顾问啊..

作者: guhelim 时间: 2012-5-1 12:31

代理那全套登峰推意帝确实太~~~~~~

作者: rock 时间: 2012-5-1 12:58

代理那全套登峰推意帝确实太~~~~~~
guhelim 发表于 2012-5-1 12:31

贵丰CD/喇叭够厚声的吧...搭配Solution 清淡得吓人...怎么听音乐啊..

作者: 红苹果 时间: 2012-5-1 13:36

贵丰CD/喇叭够厚声的吧...搭配Solution 清淡得吓人...怎么听音乐啊..
rock 发表于 2012-5-1 12:58

还清淡得吓人,哈哈,这不成了直白的直白,哪听音的风格可想而知。

作者: LCL123 时间: 2012-5-1 17:16
本帖最后由 LCL123 于 2012-5-2 09:41 编辑

Solution这样的机器,相信也是花了心血去做的,否则指标不可能做得如此出色,但厂家也许忘了机器是为音乐服 ...
rock 发表于 2012-5-1 12:24

是的，做音响很需要懂音乐的专业人士参与，Mark Levinson 和Spectral 都有这样的实证案例。

Mark Levinson的历史

Mark Levinson是二战后出生的新一代，出生于一个具有浓厚音乐氛围的家庭，母亲会演奏大提琴（多年后Mark以“大提琴”作为他创办的第二个音响品牌的名字），哥哥Doug是一个职业爵士钢琴乐手，14岁起就和爵士乐名宿一起演奏。事实上，Mark很早就开始接受音乐教育，学习过短号、小号、flugelhorn、倍大提琴甚至印度sarod琴，也一度考虑成为一个职业音乐家。从1966年到1971年，Mark有机会接触到像Sonny Rollins、Chick Corea、Keith Jarrett、Jimmy Garrison、Gary Peacock、Lee Konitz和John Coltrane等这样一批爵士名流，并和其中许多人成为了朋友。可以确定，这段时期的经历让Mark终身受益。

1972年，年轻的Mark在康涅狄格州的纽黑文创建了以他自己名字命名的Mark Levinson Audio Systems（MALS）。据Mark说，自己之所以对音频再生发生兴趣，是因为在和上述那些音乐家流连于录音棚时，发现音响器材的再生音乐与现场音乐有着很大差别。这一动机促使Mark制作出了他的第一件音响器材，专业录音用的混音台，这时Mark才21岁。这个混音台只生产了几台，其中一台被用在了1969年传奇的伍德斯托克音乐节上。可能正是这台没有正式型号的混音台，催生出了后来的MLAS。
和当时音响界以定价决定产品设计的做法不同，MLAS的设计，是以超越所有的性能限制为出发点。为此，Mark雇佣了他所知道的最好的电子工程师、机械师甚至雕刻工。曾经与MLAS合作或任职于MLAS的电子工程师都很有名，其中不少至今为发烧友们津津乐道，其中有MLAS第一款产品JC-1唱头放大器的电路设计师John Curl、学者型工程师Richard Burwen、以及从1976年起担任MLAS总工程师的Tom Colangelo，他不仅是ML-1至ML-12产品的工程师，也是后来Cello、Viola品牌的工程师。
Richard Burwen是对MLAS早期产品产生重大影响的人物，虽然他为MLAS设计的产品不多，但却是MLAS的精神导师，正是他赋予了MLAS产品以高品质零件和材料配合顶级工程技术来制造毫不妥协的音响器材的理念，这些理念都为MLAS后来的工程师所继承。Richard是电子工程领域的宗师级人物，他在1972年制作的7.5 ips带速的录音机就拥有110dB的动态范围，他为MLAS设计的LNP-2台前级，是音响史上一个里程碑式的产品，可以这么说，LNP-2的诞生，宣告了音响Hi-Fi时代的终结，而LNP-2的身后，Hi-End音响时代的朝阳正在冉冉升起！即便以现在的眼光看，1975年上市的LNP-2的性能非但不落伍，甚至还超越不少他的孙子辈器材。LNP-2是一台低噪声前级，动态范围达到惊人的140dB，声道分离度即便在高频段也超过110dB，两个声道的误差仅有0.1dB。LNP-2的功能也非常丰富，它具有一对指针式峰值电平表、具备增益切换以适应不同的讯源，LNP-2还是采用铑、铂、金等贵金属导体材料和特氟隆绝缘材料的民用音响器材的始作俑者。而LNP-2在黑色氧化面板上雕刻并以白漆填充的Mark Levinson Logo，也成为发烧友心目中极品音响器材的标志，并在以后的近40年里基本保持不变。
Richard Burwen和John Curl应该是以设计顾问的方式与MLAS合作的，他们两人设计的产品分别以LN和JC为字头，成为以后阵容更加壮观的ML字头系列产品的先声。MLAS另一款著名前级JC-2，在经过Tom Colangelo改进之后成为ML-1前级，直到1979年才被Tom设计的ML-6单声道前级所替代。

Mark Levinson本人是一个天才的产品设计师，然而却并不是一个好的经营者。上世纪70年代末，MLAS的财务状况开始恶化，到了1984年，公司已经濒临破产。

变身Madrigal

在音响业界，最受关注的焦点无疑是那些引领技术潮流的工程师型人物，Mark Levinson本人就是这一现象的最佳例证。但作为一个企业，富于远见的经营者其实更为重要，这些一般不为人注意的幕后人物对于维持公司的正常运营起着更为关键的作用。作为一个品牌，Mark Levinson是幸运的，因为就在MLAS风雨飘摇之际，它迎来了一位音响史上最成功的优秀经理人，Sandy Berlin。正是这个人，将Mark Levinson打造成了全世界最大也是最成功的极品音响电子器材制造公司。

Sandy Berlin于上世纪60年代末担任Harman/Kardon总经理，1969年哈曼并购JBL之后，Sandy被哈曼集团委派到洛杉矶对JBL进行重组。不久之后他一手建立了哈曼在欧洲的分销网络，并牵线哈曼对英国天朗的并购。在并购完成之后，他还到英国担任过一段时间天朗的主席。
1976年Sandy从哈曼集团退休，到康涅狄格州的耶鲁大学社会与政治研究院担任研究员，他以为自己从此将退出音响界。如果不是MLAS正巧也在耶鲁大学所在地的纽黑文，Sandy的这个想法可能就变成真的了。
一个偶然的机会，Sandy通过一个朋友结识了当时的纽黑文市长比亚乔·迪里耶托，比亚乔对Sandy谈起纽黑文市政府正打算帮助MLAS摆脱财务困境，因为MLAS一旦破产，当时在职的70个雇员就得失业。
1984年10月，MLAS被当地破产法庭关闭，其后两三个月内没有人来主动想寻求购买公司资产，于是法官决定将其拍卖。Sandy去了拍卖会现场，给自己的推托代理人留下了一张支票和一个出价就回了家。到了晚上，代理人来电话告诉Sandy，他已成为MLAS的新东主。1985年1月30日，公司以Madrigal Audio Laboratories的新名字重新营业，Mark Levinson作为一个商标仍然得以保留。
关于“Madrigal”这个名字，曾担任新公司市场总裁的Mark Glazier这样是解释的：“‘牧歌’（Madrigal）乃文艺复兴时的一种歌唱形式，相对于‘一个个人’而言，它是由‘一个群体’所唱出来的。我们不再把自己定位于一个个分离的个体，而是比‘个人’更有能力更有成就的团队。”

Spectral 的历史

经历过1960~70年代的极盛时期，美国音响似乎盛极而衰，君不见Marantz、McIntosh已经卖给日本公司，JBL与Altec也在顶级音响的领域退守一方，若没有Mark Levinson出现力挽狂澜，美国Hi End音响几乎要成为绝响。不过，在看似退潮的美国Hi End音响品牌当中，Spectral则是长期受到遗忘的优秀产品。

严肃的聆听艺术

1977年成立的Spectral，老闆Richard(Rick) Fryer秉持着开创音乐聆听新视野的理想，找来Reference Recording（RR）的Keith Johnson博士，负责所有Spectral器材的设计。标榜着「严肃聆听的艺术」（The Art of Serious Listening），Spectral以追求「State-of-the-art」为目标，Rick相信完美不仅需要不断努力，而且是奢华（luxury）的追求，要完全不考虑成本、不计算市场利基、不跟随时尚流行，为音乐老饕（connoisseur）设计与製作最高品质的器材。

Rick可说是识马伯乐，邀请Keith Johnson负责Spectral的设计，1977年创业时，Spectral推出了MS ONE前级，设计的目标就是要达到前所未有的参考标准。MS ONE在当年树立了三大创举，是第一部达到DC到Megahertz频宽的前级、第一部能直接将低输出唱头讯号放大到高电平，而不需要额外增益，并且是首部晶体双单声道的前级。在今日晶体技术与製程进步的时代，要达到Megahertz的频宽并不非常困难的事，但是Spectral竟然在1977年就能够做出来，而双单声道的架构，则成为众多Hi End前级竞相模彷的特点。

中性与自然快速
想知道Spectral的声音，最好的方法是买几张RR的CD来欣赏，那种辽阔的空间感、很深沉的低频，庞大的气势与到处挥洒的细节，快捷猛烈让人喘不过气的动态，还有自然优美的质感，不但是RR录音的特色，也是Spectral最佳的写照。Keith Johnson是史丹福变压器电子工程专家，也是高能物理、管风琴与录音器材的专家，早年曾在Ampex、Guass公司服务过，当时就设计了一部磁头偏压达3.5MHz的三轨录音机。此外，他还参与过早期数码光电录音录像的计画，后来的具体成果就是CD。喜欢赛车的MIT老板Bruce Brisson，本身也是录音高手的Wilson Audio老板David Wilson，与Spectral刚好结成铁三角，加上Keith Johnson助阵，难怪Richard Fryer说Spectral的产品是以音乐来背书的。
我在很多地方听过Wilson Audio喇叭，印象最深刻的还是搭配Spectral扩大机。记得有一次以David Wilson自己录制的《舞台正中》CD演示，喇叭是Grand SLAMM，线材当然是MIT。管乐火热激昂当然没话说，等到大鼓现身，一阵风突然从喇叭冲了出，房间的灯光剎时间暗了下来，然后声波打击到胸口，全身麻酥酥的居然说不话来。接下来几段音乐那快如迅雷的低音不停卷动裤管，而中高音一点不躁不吵，人声还相当饱满甜美，味道是属于淡雅朴素一类，但无比自然生动的表情始终令人难忘。

作者: 残月 时间: 2012-5-2 00:27
回复 rock 的帖子

可能是搭配器材不同吧，但这两款前级基本上是同一种音色

作者: 阿昆 时间: 2012-5-2 00:40
瑞士Solution登峰的确寡淡无味的，不好听。

欢迎光临极品人生 (http://hk.hiendlife.com/x1/)